Talk: Robert April

Should we include material on April from the novels? Diane Carey's Final Frontier and Best Destiny provided a lot of background to him, and it's been picked up in other novels and stories as well. There's also some potentially conflicting information from the Star Trek: Early Voyages comics, but it could be reconcilled with the novels.

Also, where does the middle initial "M" come from? I've always seen it stated as being Robert T. April. --TimPendragon 16:32, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

We shouldn't include novels (or comics), as a rule; that's the Non-Canon Star Trek Wiki's job. (I say that with nothing but love for those works. In several cases there are differing continuities for particular characters in the novels (including April). Which do we use? Best to avoid it altogether, as much as possible.) But if the material happens to coincide--say for example, a character who is the offspring of Mackenzie Calhoun, who is strictly a novel-character--then Calhoun could get an entry, and in the background it would be noted that he is from the New Frontier novels.

I've also seen it both ways, "M." and "T.", although when I tried to find where I saw the T, I couldn't locate it. I've seen Gene's original pitch, where it was M. I believe as the name evolved, it switched from M to T (later becoming Pike, Winter then Kirk). M. was still the most original. --Sasoriza 17:46, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure that is the best course to take. April's history here should at least mention his novel appearances and the details of such, with links to Memory Beta and the full articles. -- Captain M.K.B. 14:38, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

We could always break the article down with the known canon/TAS data in the introduction, with different sections for his background according to the a) Final Frontier and Best Destiny, b) Early Voyages, c) Arcadia, d) ST:3000, e) Pendragon, f) Origins, etc... --TimPendragon 17:45, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Well put, Tim.. that's how I've been approaching canon or non-canon related articles lately -- for example, the USS Archon article is here, on this wiki, because it was mentioned in several fan-blueprints, but i also included cursory canon and novel data about it. - Captain M.K.B. 00:20, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

"First command"?

Is the fact that Enterprise was April's first command actually canon? In most interpretations of the character I've read, he's been a bit older, more seasoned than either Pike or Kirk when he assumed command. Final Frontier has him as the main force behind the Constitution-class, and mentions at least one previous command. The Early Voyages comic series says he commanded the Tiberius on three five-year missions before assuming command of the Enterprise. --TimPendragon 08:07, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

According to Roddenberry it was. Hence his inclusion in the Okudachrons and TNG Tech Manual. --Sasoriza^A•T 15:56, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Trying to parse that sentence, you're saying that if it wasn't his first command, he wouldn't have been included in the Chronology or Tech Manual? I know he was the first captain of the Enterprise, but it wasn't necessarily his first command, was it? Even if it was stated as such in Roddenberry's first treatment, that was back when April was a proto-Kirk - young at the time of his command - which was contradicted by TAS and later sources. --TimPendragon 17:41, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

He didn't command a starship until he was 50? That's kind of odd. I like the idea that he commanded the Yorktown and then went on to build the Constitutions & command the Enterprise. But, that's just me. --JusticeCEO 16:17, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

I wasn't saying anything other than what I said, Tim. Roddenberry wanted April to be "official", so they counted April in. --Sasoriza^A•T 00:55, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Understood, but you're missing my question. Where is it stated/canon that April commanded no ships before Enterprise? --TimPendragon 05:01, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Oh, I see what you mean. That line came from the MA article--don't know where they drew that conclusion. I took the liberty of nixing it. It's quite possible that he might have commanded other ships beforehand. Given the supposed importance of the Connies at the time, I can't imagine they'd give such ships to newbie captains. --Sasoriza^A•T 05:48, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Whew... Thanks, that's all I wanted. I've never seen the assertian that Enterprise was his first ship anywhere but on MA. Everyone from Alan Dean Foster to Marvel Comics has said that he was a Captain long before the 1701's launch, though the ship(s) he commanded vary. As JusticeCEO said, he had to have had a command before age 50. --TimPendragon 06:00, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

By the way -- one of the tiny trivia references tieing in the comics and the novels, the comics have April as former captain of Tiberius, and Carey's novels depict April as a close friend of George Kirk, who ends up giving his son Jimmy "Tiberius" as a middle name (of which April is aware of). Does this imply George Kirk has a connection with the USS Tiberius under April's command? -- Captain M.K.B. 07:02, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

For Pendragon at least, that's a resounding yes. Final Frontier was one of the first Trek novels I ever read, and remains my favorite, and I loved the Early Voyages comic (until the quality went down in the last couple issues). --TimPendragon 07:07, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Complete overhaul

How does the article look now? I think I've done a fairly decent job of separating canon from non-canon from fanon here. Any thoughts? --TimPendragon 07:51, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Good job! For that you deserve a thumbs-up.

--Sasoriza^A•T 08:57, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Agreed - Good job! -- Sneg ^Admin•Talk 09:03, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Well done! --JusticeCEO 11:44, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

Third Complete Overhaul

I wrote a "temp" page that attempts to combine non-conflicting Robert April info together, from the canon/non-canon/fanon sources. It's not as clearly separated as the previous version, but everything is cited and it was written with the intent on using non-canon sources to fill in canon gaps, and then fanon sources to fill in other gaps. Fanon material that conflicts with official material is listed, but italicized as background material. I also added links to the four main fanon Aprils (like how James T. Kirk (ST:NV) has links) in order to expand on the character as he is portrayed in those materials.--Tim Thomason 20:20, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

Names

Robert Timothy April? Oh, brother. --– Sasoriza ^{Adm • Tlk} 08:10, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Hey, it was used in fanfic looooooong before me. In an interview, Diane Carey even said she thought that was his middle name, though I don't think it actually wound up in her novels. Besides, Tiberius and Thomas were already taken. How many more good "T" names are out there? Turlough just doesn't cut it. :-P --TimPendragon 08:25, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Just say "Robert Timothy April" out loud, and tell me if that doesn't flow off the tongue well. If you have a better suggestion, I'm listening... :-) --TimPendragon 08:30, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

How about.... Robert Todd April. ;) – Sasoriza ^{Adm • Tlk} 08:42, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

Okay, you got me, but Timothy is still a much more common English name than Todd. ;-P --TimPendragon 08:46, 9 December 2006 (UTC)